Join Bridge Winners
All comments by Ian Casselton
1 2 3 4 5
You are ignoring the author of this comment. Click to temporarily show the comment.
Hi Gerben.

Anyone who plays DBL as T/O of is speaking my language here (see earlier reply).

Ian C
an hour ago
You are ignoring the author of this comment. Click to temporarily show the comment.
Hi David.

I think I'm fairly much in agreement with you.

I have a fairly simple rule - if DBL can possibly be take-out, it is (of the most likely, else the most important, possibility).

Here, the only consideration is of what suit? As we don't have relative frequency information and a chance to discuss in advance, logic dictates we care most about the situation when the oppo have the spade raise, so DBL should be T/O of that (with, as you say, whatever kind of Lebensohlish structure you might play thereafter).

It's worth noting as an aside that the thing they have given us here is a safe'ish entry point - it is slightly more dangerous going in after (1) Pass (2) ?

Other actions should be as after the above auction in my opinion, so 2 should be Michaels if that is your normal style etc.

Pass then DBL (e.g. of 2) I prefer as penalty (or perhaps Co-operative Penalty in The Bridge World lexicon).

I would only deal with an effective 1 2 auction from the opponents if it is confirmed explicitly in the later action.

Ian C
23 hours ago
You are ignoring the author of this comment. Click to temporarily show the comment.
No disagreement from me, Bernard.

Ian C
April 19
You are ignoring the author of this comment. Click to temporarily show the comment.
Hi Michael R.

Agreed, but as Richard observes (and I commented in the team discussion) if you're playing to go down but minimise the loss, ducking the K seems the right start.

As a matter of interest, after that start, do you think you would have found the two down defence?

Ian C
April 19
You are ignoring the author of this comment. Click to temporarily show the comment.
Hi Michael R and others.

Thanks for replying!

For the record, when given the problem, I said I would take the hook fairly quickly. This was not the result of some deep analysis, but rather, a philosophy which leads to a fairly blunt heuristic - play to make unless that is demonstrably inferior by inspection. I think there are more important things to expend time and effort on.

Nevertheless, the deal caused considerably debate amongst my normal team, not all of whom (including me) were playing on the day.

In the brief analysis that I did, as much to consider the possibility of whether I could possibly induce round suit honours to crash as anything else, I judged that the hook was likely to be slightly anti-percentage. I reckoned LHO was a strong favourite to hold the J as well as the KQ for the lead, and that of the five remaining relevant cards, RHO would hold four of them. Yes, RHO might open with only three of them if AAK, or I could be wrong about the J, but that would make LHO considerably less inclined to sell out to 3.

However, as alluded to by others above, spades might be 5-3 and not 4-4 and with three prime cards plus the Q, RHO might have found 3. Hence, I think my a priori near 1 in 5 chance of LHO holding the Q is perhaps closer to 1 in 4 in practise.

For anyone interested in the actual result, the LH/RH hands were

T952 K KQJ4 9765 / Q874 A75 9862 AK

My usual teammate took the hook, which of course lost, and the oppo did negotiate the club ruff. This led to -300 and a loss of 5 IMPs against the 1NT by E making contract in the other room. This was the margin of a 7-12 loss in the match, and enough to move them from equal second to fourth in the event (it was the final match).

Unlucky, I think, but not all agreed …

Ian C
April 19
You are ignoring the author of this comment. Click to temporarily show the comment.
Hi Avon.

I agree with most of your premises - perhaps your influence (conscious or sub-conscious)?

Geoffo and I played 1 2 and 1 2NT as FG raises and 1 2NT and 1 3 as BAL, FG for years. Our current 1M 2 response (FG, clubs or raise, as per The Bridge World article “CLOR”) is similar - also allowing 2NT as BAL, FG and preserving even more space for the raise.

As to Barry's question, and unlike some, we play (the equivalent of) 1m 2m as an FG raise and 1m 2NT as an INV raise, both in an 11-13 1NT opening context. With a weaker raise than that it's 3m, or (the equivalent of) 1NT.

Edit: An additional comment - I would have no particular issue in many methods in bidding 1 1 or 1 1 on a 3 card suit, rather than 1NT, for positional reasons if unable to otherwise conveniently show a 4 card minor suit raise. I just don't need to in our current method.

Ian C
April 18
Ian Casselton edited this comment April 18
You are ignoring the author of this comment. Click to temporarily show the comment.
Understood, Johan.

I'm not sure that allowing for 4m333's is that descriptive though. Don't get me wrong, though - see my earlier post, my own method doesn't work well on this hand.

Allowing a free and easy 2 response is one thing - it can't get in the way of partner and may be quite descriptive. I would think a reasoned argument can be made that the trade-off for doing the same with a 2 response can be made. But bidding 3m on BAL hands will get in the way a lot and hasn't (at that point at least) been that descriptive).

Ian C
April 7
You are ignoring the author of this comment. Click to temporarily show the comment.
Hi Johan.

I understand both Richard's instinctive reaction and your rationale. We have a similar underlying principle opposite our 1 0-10 hcp Fert and an artificial and strong 1 response … we play opener's 2 rebid as 0-4 hcp any, unsuitable for a 3+ pre-empt. This gives definition to everything else - the worst thing is that we can't then bid 2 over it NAT (as that is reserved for FG types).

My biggest issues, in order, with your structure would be the 3/3/2 bids - they are likely to get in the way of 2 opener too often IMO.

As an aside, doesn't 3 have to be 5+?

Ian C
April 6
You are ignoring the author of this comment. Click to temporarily show the comment.
Hmm.

Perhaps not a great hand for our methods - lucky the big ones don't come up very often!

P 2
2 4
?

What would you do here as responder?

Hard to be honest knowing all the hands, but I might be inclined to punt 6.

Ian C
April 6
You are ignoring the author of this comment. Click to temporarily show the comment.
Hi Larry,

Not saying you're wrong (I've not seen this suggested before, so haven't properly considered it). But why might you be right?

As someone who uses a top'n'bottom variant, combined with ELCD's to the higher two suits, I'm keen to understand any material technical merit.

Ian C
April 5
You are ignoring the author of this comment. Click to temporarily show the comment.
Hi Jeff.

At risk of answering for someone clearly more expert than me, “… of course …”.

However, by rough analogy, after (1NT) P (3NT) DBL, is your agreement that partner leads (i) spades, or (ii) their shorter major, or (iii) their shortest suit, or (iv) something else?

Considering (i) through (iii) above only, as a spectrum, you get increasing frequency of potential usefulness, but tempered by more risk. I see “Obvious Shift” based carding analogous to (i) - more accurate when directly applicable, but less flexible otherwise. In context, straight attitude is closer to (ii) or (iii) in nature.

Both approaches appear playable to me, so it is probably down to whatever suits - though I'm probably more philosophically aligned to Kit's view.

Ian C

PS As a related aside, for most of our carding (leads, signals, discards) except where specifically otherwise defined, we played “Mixed” signals, i.e. reverse count without a honour (initially defined as Q or higher versus suits, J or higher vs NT's) and natural count with a relevant honour. As opposed to a directive style of signals/carding, this requires you to use a lot of “bridge logic” - but like anything is imperfect.
April 4
You are ignoring the author of this comment. Click to temporarily show the comment.
Hi Thomas.

I remember Ulf's article. I also remember another one (might have been Ulf, might have been Denis Lesage) suggesting a similar use of 2-suited overcalls combined with a cue-bid being played as a Multi (rather than Michaels) - to get the single-suited WJO's back. Note that this, in principle, gives you four two-suited jumps (the three former WJO's plus 2NT).

All that said, I don't play any of them, and prefer
(1) ELCD's to the top two suits - showing the 2nd higher suit to be at least as long as the higher
(2) Cue-bid as top'n'bottom: 5+/5+ if (1) 2 else 4+/5+m

I don't feel strongly about all the above except that I don't like Michaels - but as a convention, it's come back strongly into vogue recently (and played very wide ranging - which I like even less).

Ian C
April 3
You are ignoring the author of this comment. Click to temporarily show the comment.
Hi Kit.

I'm one of those who would have opened 1 and rebid 2 over a 1 response (though probably raised 1 to 2). This risks the odd wrong partial, and I'm sure over the years it must have happened, but I can't recall a recent incident along those lines. As a general principle in bidding, I believe it is more effective to show a second suit rather than emphasise length in the first.

On a related note, I would probably have bypassed 1 to respond 1 - but I'm fairly sure that's a minority position. That brings up the interesting ELCD question of what the auction (1m) DBL (1) P (2m) 2 means. I'm guessing you can't do it with this hand, though you might want to, and that it still retains its traditional strong meaning - maybe I'm wrong?

Finally, to opener's rebid. I require NT rebids to show BAL/semi-BAL hands and non-forcing rebids of a suit to show 6+ length: hence that leaves the 1 opening. But of the two rules, I detest breaking the latter rule more. Therefore, I don't have a particular issue with a 1 1 1NT auction in a partnership where that possibility is (subsequently) catered for, but dislike the auction at the table and have little sympathy over the outcome.

In the discussion above, I have not particularly considered the effect of West's DBL on the North/South bidding. For what it's worth, I wouldn't seek a 1 level penalty as North either - if for no other reason than the hand is marginally weak opposite a modern opening style.

Ian C
April 1
Ian Casselton edited this comment April 1
You are ignoring the author of this comment. Click to temporarily show the comment.
Agreed, Nigel.

As you allude to, it is almost impossible at the table to know what your peers would do in many (most?) arbitrary UI situations, so the only pragmatic approach is to do what you would normally do when you are reasonably confident that is the case.

After that, you can let the gendarmes sort it out if they need to.

Ian C
March 30
You are ignoring the author of this comment. Click to temporarily show the comment.
Hi Aviv.

I'm with Kit on this one (and I think the Rubens editorial is similarly - though it also deals with the mechanics of how one might approach taking the “normal” action).

That is why this is a good example scenario for discussion, as it flushes out, amongst other things, how the laws are interpreted radically different by many.

Ian C
March 30
You are ignoring the author of this comment. Click to temporarily show the comment.
Hi Paulo.

It is based on my recollection of a pub conversation, of what the player at the table described as his thought process as he tried to rationalise what 4 might be if not natural (which he thought was likely).

Ian C
March 30
You are ignoring the author of this comment. Click to temporarily show the comment.
Apologies, Paul.

You're testing my knowledge of their system. As per my response to Michael, I'm reporting as accurately as I can recall, and the impression I got was that 2 was F1 and 2 was FG.

I guess, stylistically, they must bid their shape naturally with INV+ hands.

Ian C
March 30
You are ignoring the author of this comment. Click to temporarily show the comment.
Thanks, Chris.

It is interesting the variance we are already getting on this - useful to note.

One thing I would say is that North was clearly intending to act ethically IMO. By waiting until after, but then saying anyway, they opened himself up more rather than less - not the action of someone trying to hide.

I suppose the variable factor here is the surety in the method. For example, if 2 were considered FG, then there are those that might play 2 as natural (in context). In that scenario, rather than confuse the issue before the play, it might be expedient to point things out after the play and take whatever medicine, if any, is coming to you. That's just me musing out loud though.

Ian C
March 30
Ian Casselton edited this comment March 30
You are ignoring the author of this comment. Click to temporarily show the comment.
Thanks, Richard.

Ian C
March 30
You are ignoring the author of this comment. Click to temporarily show the comment.
Sorry, Chris.

Corrected!

Ian C
March 30
1 2 3 4 5
.

Bottom Home Top